I'm Eliana, can you share your screen? Thank you all so much again for joining. My name is Alicia Sepulveda and I'm also going to be the moderator and also presenting with my colleague Alina. We're both gonna be introducing ourselves just very quickly. My name is Alicia. Suppose I have been an academic coach, a success coach for 11 years, and have worked at Florida State University at a non-profit college access organization. I've also worked at University of Northern Colorado where I was working with students who said that they wanted to lead the institution within the first six weeks of being there. And so that was a really fun and challenging coaching practice and coaching program. So I did that for three years and then found myself at University of Colorado Boulder where I served as an academic coach there. And that's really where over my time as a coach had gone to several conferences and gotten to connect with so many of you already and got to meet so many people who are leaders in this space. And then a few of us got together to really create Chuck, and it's been such a beautiful journey for me during that time. I also got my PhD in higher education and student affairs leadership. And I have published a few studies related to academic coaching and specifically my dissertation. And we're going to refer to my dissertation throughout this presentation because some of the content is actually from that dissertation. So this is really interesting to you and you want to read a lot of pages. You can feel free to check out my dissertation and I'm happy to share that in the link later. Right now I'm working on a fellowship program at University of Colorado system that's focused on research and innovation and entrepreneurship. So that's been a little bit change of pace for me, it recently, but I'm still involved with check and still have a super big heart and passion for coaching and higher education. So that's the ends, Elana, and why don't you go ahead. Awesome. Thanks so much. Thanks for joining us, everybody. We're so excited to have you here. There are so many of you, it's so exciting and what gratitude I have for this space in check and to connect with you all and to have Alicia here as our founder. As Kathleen said this morning. And I am Melinda Davis, dull area. I am at University of Colorado Boulder. I had been there for the last 20 years as a staff member. And seven years ago, I transitioned into an academic coach role when we started our first academic coaching program on campus. And so we made a lot of the mistakes. If I'm being honest, I mean, we did a lot of the things that we're going to talk about today. And so we come from a place of experience at CU Boulder that said, We have absolutely learned and grown and we're very fortunate to have five academic coaching programs, designated academic coaching programs within colleges and schools and programs at CU Boulder. And we are constantly advocating to expand to that footprint because we recognize and understand how impactful coaching experience can be for a student who's both at the university and doing fine and at the university and at risk of not retaining or not doing well. I am so grateful to join you today and we'll just move straight into it. And we are going to be doing our best to monitor the chat. But if you do have a question, please also feel free to use the raise hand function so that we know that we have a question coming in with that chat because it's a lot of screens to keep track of all at once. Okay. Is my screen moving? Okay? Are you all seeing the slides advance? Excellent. Thank you so much. Do an overview of what we're going to go over today. We're going to talk about what academic coaching is and some of the things that maybe it's not we're going to talk about are fixing instinct as humans, putting all of that into practice and talking about skilled intuition. And we're going to talk about some common traps that we find with using skilled intuition as well as the ethical considerations that we have to think about as coaches when we're putting all of these things into coaching session, let's talk about what academic coaching is and maybe what it's not. So a lot of us think of skill-building when we think of academic coaching. And a lot of institutions likely think of fixing when they think of academic coaching. So a lot of us are hired into our roles as academic coaches because the institution recognizes that there are students that are having challenges. And they think that as coaches are jobs sometimes is to fix these students and help them with their challenges and then help them move on at the university. Also were most of us who are in the coaching profession are here because we're helpers and we likely found our way here because we're great at giving advice. And so we often are in these roles because we're great at advice. We are helpers and we do want to help students and others. To make positive changes. But what we want to start by saying today is that we know that skill-building, fixing, an advice may have a place in academic coaching, but in and of themselves, they are not academic coaching. We want to recognize that there are folks in the room who likely are in hybrid or dual roles. Alicia and I have had the luxury honestly, of being able to be sole coaches. All we do is coach students and we recognize that that is a luxury. So some of the things we're going to talk about today as we talk about academic coaching may not be relevant exactly to your role if you're in that hybrid role. But we do encourage you to take some of these practices and use them in your role in whatever way they work for you. Now, let's talk a little bit about why advice giving and that's fixing are a little bit counter-intuitive. So as humans, I want us to all acknowledge and recognize that we are innate fixers. That's what we are programmed to do when we see someone in distress. When we see someone who needs help, we are naturally motivated to help them fix it, problem, to help them fix the situation. But we know as coaches and from research that comes out of motivational interviewing, that sometimes us suggesting that a problem needs to be fixed or us providing an answer to a problem in actually encounter some ambivalence. So every time a student walks into our office, we know that they're coming in with both reasons to change and reason not to change. That is completely normal. That ambivalence is normal. We know that when we push, you think about, I'm making this gesture because we know that when we push as a human, our instinct is to push back, right? And so we are, as we're giving advice or maybe telling a student how to fix something, we're naturally going to see them trying to balance the argument for not fixing it. And that's just what's happening within human behavior, is that if we're giving them reasons to fix and we are only concentrating on that, they are going to be coming up naturally with reasons not to fix. I think as part of this is really that it discounts the student's own knowledge, ideas, and their agency, right? If we move straight into a fixing advice giving space, we're discounting the students any knowledge and the ideas that they might have. And so we need to notice when we move into these fixed thing behaviors because again, they're natural. But as coaches we really have to balance them with everything else and know when the right time might be to bring them into an appointment. Let's talk about how this might actually look in practice, right? So say a student comes in, they're presenting with something like a time management issue. I want to talk about time management. Awesome. As coaches, we probably have lots of tools and strategies around time management. And so if we move straight into introducing a tool for them, it's either new to them, which would be great if they use it. It's either helpful or not helpful or maybe something else entirely. Or we introduce a strategy that they've tried before. It has either worked and they've, they're able to implement again. Or maybe it didn't work for them. And either way, if it worked or it didn't work, if we're introducing that strategy without knowing that they've implemented, without knowing that they tried it, they are likely going to start to question the benefits of coaching before they even start seeing them. We really want to talk today about how can we avoid this? Because in this particular model, we have basically one of seven chances of the information working that we're giving to them. It's either going to work or it's not work. It's not going to work and we're not giving ourselves as coaches the best chance to really develop the students self-awareness and give the student that intrinsic motivation to work on the challenge, work through some of the things that they're bringing into our office, right? As a whole students. We want to talk about why is skilled intuition matters in this context, and we're going to actually define this in a second. But the reason why we want, we care so much about this is because of the outcome that it gives us and it gives the students. So it really increases the student's competence of, oh, I have skills, I know how to use them, I know my strengths, and I know how to ask for help, when to ask for help, etc. It also builds autonomy that they have amazing ideas they have, they know already some of the things that they need to do, but they're having a really difficult time implementing those ideas. Then really what this does is it builds intrinsic motivation over time. Really helps that student become a more self-determined human. So when we're talking about coaching, we want to talk about what makes coaching coaching just to situate this space. So we're going to talk about some of the commonalities between the life coaching and academic coaching. So in both of these spaces, what we see that are really rooted in both both academic and life coaching is that the coaching beliefs, like we all believe so deeply in core that our students have potential. Like there's so much possibility and potential within our students and we love that space. That's just one example of a really strong coaching belief that we, we both have. Other things that we do is coaching skills. So thinking about active listening, powerful questioning, those are similar in both spaces. We also both believe and express that coaching is a process. Coaching takes time. It's usually not a one and done, it takes time to make progress. Then the last piece that's really common is that is who sets the agenda? It's typically not the coach setting the agenda for the students or in life coaching. It's not the person. They're not setting the agenda for the client either. In life coaching, some unique things that are, again unique to live coaching that are slightly different in academic coaching. And again, we're going to talk about why I love this back-end. So in life coaching, number one, you're getting clients in a very different way than an academic coaching. You also have a much broader agenda based on what types of coaching that you provide, as well as what the client wants to work on. Also, the client is really choosing and seeking coaching out. Typically, this isn't something where you stumble upon somebody and you're like, Oh, I need this help and I'm willing to pay for it. The person who is seeking out coaching is ready. They're wanting to make change. They're wanting support, and they are ready to go. And not only are they ready, but they're willing to pay for it. Then the other thing that's a little bit unique to live coaching is that it's, the purpose of life. Life coaching is to develop that self-awareness. You're really asking a lot of questions that are based in learning to help that person learn. Academic coaching. There are some unique features that look very different than the life coaching space. And while I think live coaching has so incredible and helping us situate coaching in academia and in higher education. It does look different. In first meetings. We have to actually sell and it really, really helps students see what they can get out of coaching. And you kinda have to share that benefits the process. Because it is usually the first time that a student is experiencing this type of relationship and this type of support service. You also have to be ready because the student readiness to engage in coaching can look drastically different. So as you may have a student on one side, on one side of the spectrum that comes in and is ready to go. They're like, Alicia, I didn't do it last semester. I know that I can do this, but I need some help. But I'm ready. Like I want to learn all the things that I can about myself and about what works for me so I can be the best student I can. Then on the other end of the spectrum, you have a student who comes in because of some reason. But they're very hesitant. They're uncertain. They're not sure what this is and they're really not sure you can help them. So we can get coaches, can work with it all of those students. But just their readiness factor is very, varies drastically. Also, We're in a very unique educational contexts. And this is where that skill-building and skilled intuition comes in and is so critical because we have so many amazing things and we have so much institutional knowledge. And sometimes it's appropriate for us to share that. Sometimes it's necessary for us to share that and then other times it's actually okay if we don't share that. At that moment, we'll talk about why as we go on. Then the last thing I'll share about that's unique about academic coaching is that we're really asking for context and learning. So we're really trying to understand and help that student develop self-awareness and asking those questions for learning. But sometimes we have to ask for contexts we have to understand. Okay, Where did you study last week, we're really diving into understanding how they're studying. Where did you study? What does that look like for you? If you're really trying to focus? Where do you go? Those are questions that I just need to know the answer with it. It also can build self-awareness with that student to really notice like, Oh, I always go there, but I don't know why I'm not very productive, right. So, but we do have to ask a little bit of context to understand where that student is coming from and also what that student has tried. I want to give a quick example when we're talking about that unique educational context and the institutional knowledge that we have. I often think about our calculus 123 classes at CU Boulder. So at CU Boulder we have two types of math. We have applied math and the math department math. So our engineers, the students that I work with in the College of Engineering, are usually taking the applied math. And the applied math is really readying those students for engineering classes and for really using that math in an engineering context. I have the institutional knowledge of knowing how the math classes and the APP m classes, as we call them, look different. I recognize that a life coach would probably not need to share that. A life coach would really focus in on what the student needed to do as they move forward. I recognize that as an academic coach, I am in a little bit of a different position because I do really have this knowledge about this class, about the way this class functions and how it might look differently from a math class that the student has seen or has even taken before at our institution. That's where we really have to use the intuition along with the skill-building to know, okay, I have this institutional knowledge and contexts that's really important to share. How and when do I share that, knowing that it needs to be shared so that it benefits the student. The most scraping lead. We're going to provide some definitions here. The first one that we want to talk about is intuition. And so really what our intuition is based on is experiences. And it's really rooted. And there's some really powerful and amazing things around intuition. And we can use that in a coaching relationship. So I'll do that, do the quick definition. Intuition is the power or faculty of attaining direct knowledge or cognition without evident rational thought and inference. We don't know why or choosing to do something or why we feel like the best thing. But there's something in us telling us that it is. So that is great and you can use that and coaching. But what we want to layer on top of that is this concept of skilled intuition that there is actually a reason why you're thinking that, why you're bringing it up and also challenging. Is this just what I think is best right now, based on my experiences, maybe with the timing of the semester, or based on what I've shared today, I've shared some of the same concepts, right, with students for three sessions. So this one's probably similar, or is it something else? And so this is where that skilled intuition comes in. And what I love about it is that it's trainable. And so this is something, this is a definition based on the research that I did for my dissertation, but it refers to a coaching skill that it combines intuition with these perception factors that have really helped coaches discern what they do in meetings and when they choose to do them. So you're not just thinking like, oh, this time management strategy seems like it would be really great. I'm going to throw it in there and see how it works. You're actually being a little bit more intentional about it. And what I saw when I interviewed coaches is that they're like going through all of these processes in their head as they're coaching a student. And it's so beautiful. And I was trying to uncover and really zoom in on that to understand how, when, and why we should introduce a scalar tool. So this typically happens in a certain points in the conversation, but it also does not have to scale. If skill-building comes in, it typically comes in, in a specific point during the conversation. Okay? So this is an example of a coaching framework. And we encourage you to use a coaching framework or multiple When take from multiple and then kinda figure out what works best for you. Especially as a newer coach. Having a coaching framework was so critical for me to really understand the flow of a meeting and also to keep time and really understand the flow of the conversation. I'm gonna go over this one very briefly, but you can read more about it later if you're interested. But this would be a session where it says this is maybe a second or third or a fourth session. Not a first meeting. What this could look like as a student comes in and you're going to first connect with that student. That's the number one thing. We want to make sure that student feels welcome, feels like they belong and we're excited to see them. The next piece is accountability. Accountability has a, It's very, can be a heavy word. But what I mean by this is I'm asking the student and following up on things that we talked about last time. Hey, how is your brother's birthday, right? Or how is that test? Right. How about Tesco that we talked about last time? What was it like to prep for that, right? And trying to understand and uncover some of the learning that they experienced from doing that or implementing that strategy. The next phase, I'm just gonna go on the left-hand side, but coaches kinda flip this. Some people do this exploration first and then the agenda. Some people help that student pick the agenda and then explore. But what happens next is once the student has identified what they want to focus on or talk about. Then that's really the growth and inside the really uncovering can really happen. Because you're really dialed in on what that student wants to achieve in that session. And also just overall too. But this is typically where skill-building comes in. But I really want to zoom in on if skill-building comes in, because it might not, it does not always come in. Sometimes you can have really powerful conversations that move the needle that changed direction for a student. But you never introduce a skill or tool. Because the student is coming up with things on their own. They already know what time management strategy works for them, but they just don't know how to implement. And you're coaching on how to implement that strategy or tool that they already use. So you never brought in anything new. But they're able to uncover that during this time. Then of course, at the end, next steps, what's next? What action do you want to take because of this session? But it really allows for deep exploration, deeper exploration intentionally before we're introducing a skill or tool with a student. We want to briefly talk about the importance of designing the lions in a first meetings. So again, last time, last one we just talked was a second, third or fourth meeting plus. But this one is really designing the alliance and first meetings. And of course, relationship building is crucial and foundational to what we do. So that has to be a priority. We also have to set expectations and then sometimes differentiate ourselves from other services on campus because it can and is very confusing from a student perspective. So I believe it's our responsibility as the coach to take ownership of that. And so to really help that student understand our role. But the purpose of that is the student knows that I am not just going to tell them what to do. I'm really setting the expectation that they are the number one priority. They are very involved in this and I expect them to show up and engage and it's going to be the most beneficial for them too. So that's really the purpose of setting that relationship and that designing that alliance and that first meeting. I love designing the alliance and I love to fall back on designing the alliance because ultimately, I'm aware that our relationship, alga coachee, coach relationship may actually be the first relationship the student has had like that in their lives, right? The student may have had coaches before, and those coaches did tell them directly what to do. They may have advisors at the institution that they've already met with. Those advisors may be very helpful in helping them to make decisions and giving them lots of information. And so I really rely on both the framework to run through my meetings as well as designing the alliance early in our relationship. The student understands what our relationship is going to look like. Because I know all of you probably understand that the coaching relationship can be a lot different. And at times because I'm asking a lot of questions, because we're doing a lot of digging. It can actually feel a little bit or an, or uncomfortable. It can actually feel just different. And so it really can be a great thing to do in designing the alliance to really explicitly state what your relationship is going to look like and what the student can expect of you and what you expected the student, because that can really help set you up for success later in the relationship. So these are some spaces where we feel like we commonly get trapped into either wanting to private advice or the student wanting us to provide advice. So one of them may be, right, the student comes in and directly states, Hey, I have an issue with time management and I'm here to fix it. Like, let's go. They know coming in, what they wanna do or how often have we heard? I just don't do well in test-taking. I need to know how to, how to do better in test-taking. Maybe the student or the coach really loves to talk about something. Maybe that student is just super into talking about say, values or the coach is really into talking about strength. So sometimes it can feel a little bit hard to not move out of that space when you're really excited with the students, really excited. And I'm sure we can all sort of also identify with this rate sometimes when a student presents in our office or in our space, our virtual spaces and overwhelmed. It can be really tough because as a coach, we just want to help the student move out of that overwhelmed space. Again, we come back to that natural fixing instincts. How can I help you to fix this? You are obviously very overwhelmed. Or sometimes again, the student just comes in and directly ask for information. Hey, I'm thinking about taking these two classes. Which class do you think I should take? And we do have that institutional knowledge, but also we're coaches. We're curious if you'd like to put into the chat, what are some of your common advice giving traps? Where do you find yourself as a coach most likely to move into that advice giving from coaching or move into that fixing from coaching. And feel free to just share them in the chat. Students directly asked for information. I wanted to share a quick one while, while this is going for. I think first off, if a student tells me that they want to eventually do research or something like that, I'm a nerd. I love doing research and unlike an especially if an undergrad student, I'm like, oh my gosh, yes, you could do so many things and I just want to like bursting, bursting with excitement. Because it's just uncommon versus for undergraduate students to really get excited about research. And I want to expose them to all the amazing things on campus. But I really like trying to hold that back is really hard for me. And then I'll also just share why this is so important. So I'm going to share a quick story. I had a student who came in and he had a 3.9 GPA. And it was referred to me from an academic advisor about time management. And he came in and said directly stated the issue, Alicia, I need to work on time management. I can't do this. You know, like it's not working. But instead of what I could have done, and this is what we're trying to avoid as say, Oh my gosh, I know what a work like. You can try these three tools and this is going to help you with time management. What I did was I took a step back and was like, okay, let's let's take a step back for a second. Let me get to know you a little bit more and understand what's happening here. But what really was happening is that he said yes to everything. He was actually really great at time management and managing his time. He knew when everything was, he showed up for everything on time. He he never forgot about assignments. You turned in everything, but he could overcommitted socially. And so he was really trying to figure out what do I say no. How do I say No? That was actually not as skill building or maybe it was skill-building, but it wasn't like a tool or strategy that I pulled from. This is something that he realized, oh, it's because I don't know how to say no. We talked about that more and uncovered a little bit more around that and gave him some at one he came up with actually some really cool strategies that I would've never came up with. So just wanted to share that quick example of why this is so critical. Sounds like an amazing coaching interaction. We also have faculty recommend students to come in for a specific purpose. Brendon mentioned that it's actually counter-intuitively when people are most overwhelm their lease, receptive to advice, but we want to give it the most in those situations when they ask what I would do. Absolutely. Right. This idea that like, well, what would you do? That is a direct question that we probably have the innate wish to answer about campus involvement. Again, coming back to those things, we have a lot of knowledge around and we want to be able to share it. Students, desperation, failing a class, life crisis. Absolutely. When I know the answer or things like what classes do I take? These are all great you all, and it's just really, you have this int by another coach where you get trapped. And so really that idea of okay, I know that this is one of the spaces in which I am really likely to move into this advice giving role. And how can I really intentionally stay in a coaching space until maybe advice giving or a little bit of information sharing is most appropriate. We're going to dive into each of these elements on how do you actually use skilled intuition in your meetings. So I'm not gonna go over these right now because we're going to have a slide for each of these. But really the bottom line you'll see at the bottom of the screen, you'll see this arrow, advice and skill building. Sometimes that's appropriate, but what we don't want to go there first, what we wanna do is really trying to move along this spectrum to where the student comes up with solutions and insight on their own. And we want to make them work for that first before we pull out our toolbox. And so we're going to talk about some strategies that you can rely on more, that you can also train around and have conversations with your coaching team about, about this to make your meetings and your student interactions better. So the first one is really knowing your students. So this is slightly different than knowing your student and building that relationship at the beginning of your conversation. This is really understanding where are you in that student at, in your relationship. Some students you're easily connect with in that first meeting, you could probably challenge them a little bit because you're kinda like there are bought in, they're engaged, they're excited to be there. But you also might have a student where you've met with them four times. And you still don't feel like there's a lot of trust there on their perspective. They still don't really understand coaching. There are still a little bit hesitant with you and trust. So understanding where you are at in that relationship is really critical as you introduce tools and skills. And one of the things when I think about this around skills and tools is that if I bring out a strategy or tool that I'm not sure will work, I need to have that relationship that's strong enough to where they trust me to say, Oh my gosh, I would love to try that. Or actually Alicia, that's not going to work for me, you know, and we need to have that relationship. And I need to be able to say I'm not attached to any of this. But truly the student believes that are not attached to the strategy or tool to. And that's where that comes in on. You also have to use and demonstrate powerful listening. We want to really make sure that we're recognizing how the students showing up. So if the student comes in and always has a lot of energy, is very engaged. And then in a third or fourth or fifth meeting, they show up and they're just slightly different. Their demeanor is different. You might have to being aware of that in that in that meeting is so critical in how you approach that meeting in that conversation. We want to obviously encourage self-awareness always so understanding their values and strengths. And how does that show up in the context of what we're talking about and what the agenda is today. So again, not just then, what do they value as a human, but how does it actually come into, like in this moment? But then also again, that trust and risk. There is a risk when you pull out a new tool or strategy. Again, you really have to know where that students at and what they've done before to make it the most efficient or not efficient, but the most productive and helpful for that student. So really, that trust factor is critical. We talked a little bit about readiness in the academic coaching relationship. Again, some of our students are ready to make change and others are not. On the right here you'll see this is the stages of change. If you're unfamiliar with this, it's a really helpful way to think about where a student might be in a process and if they're ready to make change and then how to help them get from one phase to the next. But really listening for those keywords in that one meeting that you have with them. What are some of the gap words? What are the change talk or are they saying? Or having expressing language that really shares that they're ready and able to make change? Or are they expressing one thing? Maybe they're saying I can make change or I want to make change, but they don't feel like they can. And how do you see that disconnect and being really intentional about that? You want to give students space to think and to process. Especially we ask such great questions as coaches. And so letting it sit and land and really understanding how it lands with that student to say, Oh, are they really trying to think through this question because you asked a really great one, is it really hard for them to answer? And then also just how engaged are they whenever you're asking these questions and taking them through the coaching process. Then the other thing is around just observations and really reflecting what you've noticed. So sometimes I will say, you know, you kinda mentioned that you want to work on time management for three sessions in a row. I'm kinda getting the sense that you're really not not interested. What are your thoughts on that? So again, just reflecting back what I've seen, what I've noticed in what I've heard in the session, again, to really understand, are they really ready to make this change or not? And Stephanie just mentioned in the chat this idea of how do you manage the time needed for the relationship building when you are very aware of the time constraints and the student walks in maybe mid semester trying to find progress. And Stephanie, I just want to acknowledge that I think that all of us as coaches really do hear that and feel that, right? This idea of like how do you balance all of these things, especially when you may not have the time or the student may not have time to really cultivate that. That being said, I will say from my perspective, I think all of the things that we've been talking about, if you can do a couple of these things are if you can hold space for that student while maybe digging in, diving deeper, I think that really does build the relationship. I don't necessarily feel like the relationship has to be built at the beginning. I feel like my relationships are built throughout sessions, but I also want to acknowledge that when a student just comes in and again, they want an answer or they need immediate help that can make it really difficult. And so hopefully some others in the room will also have some insight that they can share on this because lots of expertise in this room that we would love to hear from. Diving deeper the next step and skillful intuition. And I love diving deeper because I think this is really where we shine as coaches. This is really where we can say like, this is what we do within all of these things. So again, I'm going to invite you when you're diving deeper to notice the urge to give advice. Because the first step to sort of waiting and using that skillful intuition is to notice it and be able to delay it. Ask powerful questions. Again, we, as coaches, powerful questions comes up so often, but really, those powerful questions are what, what's going to allow us to dive deeper and to really get into discovering the student's motivation, their values, the importance to them. It may be important to me that a student's succeeds at the university. That's what I really want them to do. It may be important to them for another reason. So really discovering that meaning can be impactful to the students intrinsic motivation and their ability to succeed. And what we're talking about in our appointment. As Alicia said, we want to make observations and especially observing hesitancy because that's a really great space to stop as a coach because we have observed it and ask about it, mention it makes sure that the student recognizes the hesitancy as well. Sometimes there's going to be reservations with moving into a strategy or moving into changing something. And again, as a coach, if we can notice that hesitancy, that's a great and really purposeful space where we can move into the conversation. Clarification, I think is something that's often needed as well as coaches, we often work with similar students, right? They all come in with unique perspectives, unique identities. But really as they come in and out of our offices, they are all probably working within the same institution, within the same classes. So as a coach, it can be really helpful for us to ask for clarifications so that we really know how is this student's time management or study habit discussion different from the student that I had maybe right before or yesterday. And all of these things are really delicate balance, right? And again, we're relationship-building through this, but there may be spaces in which abolition fed the truck. It just hasn't been developed. The student really doesn't want to dig any deeper, or maybe you're digging into something that really is best handled by another professional. And that's where maybe more support is needed, either if you're stuck or maybe where do I start? That's when as a coach, that skillful intuition really does help you acknowledge, Okay, this is great and I want to keep coaching the student, but more support may be needed in other areas. And again, as we move through the coaching session, maybe I need to, and it's actually ethical for me to make these referrals to resources that the student may not know about. And then exploring possibilities, right? So this component is also one of my favorite because it's really sort of this space where we allow the student within our assumptions as a coach, that we really do believe in them, that we believe in their ability, that we are there for them. We allow the student to expand the possibilities and explore the possibilities around what they can achieve. And really we can, we can ask a lot of questions within digging and diving deeper to know what they could do. We can really encourage critical thinking. We can strategize together. And this is really where we're starting to bridge between really holding back from that advice giving and from sharing information into this space where we might be taking a little bit less risk by doing it, but we always make sure that we're doing it together. So how can you and I strategize together, right? And as a coach, I'm often going to encourage bad ideas. I'm going to really encourage stepping away from judgment of those ideas because we may come up with something really, really beautiful. You can also ask the miracle question. If we waved a magic wand tomorrow and all of this, I sort of was resolved. What would that look like and what would it take to get there? One of the things that I really love doing is I actually really love taking a student outside of the classroom and say, Okay, we've been talking a lot about school. We've been talking a lot about your work within the classroom. Out of the classroom. How do you learn and build skill in spaces outside of the classroom? And then once they start talking, because quite often the flood gates will open at that point, right? They want to talk about their gaming, they want to talk about their sport or their musical instrument they play. And we will talk about what, what actions are you taking to build those skills and to learn outside of that. And then I invite them to bring all of those insights back into the classroom. Awesome. You did a great job in learning all of those things outside of the classroom. You were so into it and you're so excited. Let's bring all of those actions and strategies into the classroom and talk about what they might look like if you are utilizing those in the classroom. I can't tell you how often a student will tell me, well, in my musical instrument or even in gaming, I practice all the time. And then we start talking about their math class. And it it really does start to hit because they've just said, it wasn't me saying, Well, you really could use a little bit more practice. They've just said, I practice a ton, and that's where I really develop habit and develop proficiency. And then we bring it back in to the class and they're like, Oh, practice. And so I think that can be the really powerful piece that we really invite them to explore and expand possibilities. We really recognize that we are allowing them to again bring in their own insight and their own knowledge and connect that with their own motivation to do it really quick, I wanted to answer a question about the miracle question. So an example of a miracle question would be, if you woke up tomorrow and everything was exactly as you want it to it what would what would it be? What would be different, or what would that look like? So it's kind of imaginative and you can really start to see what's important for that student. What would make the biggest difference potentially for them? Yeah. Absolutely. Sorry. Thanks, sir. No, absolutely. I want to go back a little bit to the strategizing together. One of the tools I often use as well as the trading off brainstorming, right? So let's go through a four minute exercise. I'm going to time it. I'm going to give us enough time that it doesn't feel overwhelming, but that there's plenty of time. And let's just go back and forth and come up with ideas. You come up with the first idea, all come up with the one we reserve all judgment at this point, they end as a coach, I tried to offer completely ridiculous ideas at this point so that the student knows that No idea is off limits. And this, I have to say created one of the most beautiful moments I've ever had in coaching where I had a student that was really struggling. She came in, we were on our fourth appointment. She would still like, I know I need to study. I know I need to put in the work. I don't know how and why I'm not doing that. And we really did move into this exploration which exchanged ideas. And one of the ideas that she came up with, well, I'm a competitive person. So I have this makeup palette that I just bought that I had shipped to my parents house. If I make a bet with my sister that she gets that makeup palette. If I don't make bees in my classes, I think that will be motivating. That would never have been an idea that I came up with. I'm not a competitive person and I will tell you that that everything changed for that student from that meeting on, she came back in and she was like, I'm gonna get that makeup palette. She is not going to win that makeup palette. I'm going to get these in my classes. And you know what? She absolutely did. And she was so proud of herself because she came up with the idea and she owned it. And at that point it was hers. She moved forward in it and I was just there as a coach to support her. And again, that wasn't me, that was all her. But the framework and holding back on advice was what allowed that to happen. So what's next rate? We've we've held back on the advice. But now it may be time to move into share some information. What's next really is knowing your toolbox. Knowing does the student right now maybe needs something and could you suggest something and then asked how they feel about it, that strategy based or that's more exploratory base. Do you have a tool that's very specific and based on everything that the student has shared and that insight that has come out. Do they really want something specific or do they want something that's more flexible? Again, do you need something that's going to narrow the students focus because they're overwhelmed and they've just got a lot of possibilities, or do you need something that's going to expand because their focus is so narrow that they're missing some of the possibilities. And something even as simple as, right, if I tried to give a really digitally savvy student a piece of paper, they may just be like, Are you serious? So even something as simple as knowing whether you have a physical or digital tool. This is a space where we really like to say that offering more than one tool. And that's why I loved the brainstorming because I can, I can infuse those strategies into that brainstorming and it feels very natural. It doesn't feel like advice, it's just another idea. Operating more than one gives greater student choice and gives greater autonomy and really is going to lead us into that place of authentic intrinsic motivation for the student. Whereas I said with that student, they own what they've chosen and they can move forward with that urgency. So of course, I think one of the things that you've heard multiple times throughout this presentation is hold back, hold back, hold back. That should be our go-to hold back and intentionally really make that student work. And there's also ethical considerations here, right? This is not across the board with every single student. We want to show up as their coach, but we also have to share pertinent and institutional knowledge. And then sometimes it's outside of our scope because the students in crisis, To be honest, my coaching role goes out the window and I'm literally there to support that human in that moment and then help them figure out what we need to do. And sometimes if that student is in crisis, I'm like, okay, here's what we're gonna do. I'm gonna do, we're gonna do this, then we're gonna go here, and then we're going to, you know, whatever it is and I'm going to walk them through it because that's the right thing to do. So we just want to share that and mention that. But then not knowing about something and then eventually getting to them or getting it to them to that space on their own is what is what the ideal situation is. Another thing I want to share is that pertinent institutional knowledge in Atlanta and I work together, we worked with students who are below a 2 GPA. And inevitably the last two days before the withdrawal deadline, we would have students could withdraw from a class. And it was really critical because they were already below a 2 GPA. And so depending on how they were doing in that time, some students were like, I don't know what to do. I don't know if I should drop this class. And while as a coach, I'm more than happy to talk through that decision and that's super critical for my role as a coach. There's also this other element in advising where if they drop this class, they could be off track to graduate when they want. It could affect their financial aid. There are so many other factors that we have to consider. And so as my and my role given the timeframe of the semester, again, that might be an ethical consideration that I might have to address, at least to a certain extent because they can't see their academic advisor tomorrow before the drop deadline. We have to kinda play within that. But again, just being being aware and doing it very intentionally, like, okay, this is the student's not gonna get there. I got to figure this out today together, right. And that's okay. But that should not be our go-to. That should be okay. We have to at this point now because we've already had them think through and work and try to develop and get there on their own. And I want to speak to a question that came in to the chat from Julia. What would be an example of ridiculous strategy that you would offer students? We're building up a comfortable sharing space. I mean, I will go honestly as far they can lay. There have been times that I'm like, alright, You give you pull out. $40 in cash and you give your student $5 every time you don't study, or you give your roommate $5 every time you don't study, or you have to call your mom and tell her every time you don't turn in a homework assignment quite often, I'll link it back to the values that the student has, that It's something. Or I can also make it something that's completely opposite of their values. Again, to push them knowing that that counter, because it's just the idea that this point and we've completely abandoned judgment because that's one of the rules that I set out at the beginning of the brainstorming. So I will sometimes just throw out ideas that really makes us do to go like no. And I'm like, Okay, what's next? As a way to really open them up to their own ideas and to show them. There's no idea that's off limits here. We're only just generating ideas. So that later we can come back in with a more sort of judgmental eye and say, what do we think is going to work for us? But that is really a space and coaching that I love because I've been able to, without fixing, without offering much advice throughout the appointment, I've been able to gain all of this insight about the student. Hopefully the student has also gained a lot of insight about themselves. I mean, that's really what we're going for. But then I can use all of that as I move into helping the student with skill-building as a way to be able to really push it back to the student and say, like I heard you mentioned that family is really something that you value and the family plays an important part in why you are here and why you want to succeed. What would it look like to involve your family in this goal? What would it be the light to bring your family into this goal? And sometimes they're like, absolutely not. And then I'm like, okay, let's move on from that. And sometimes they're like, Oh, yeah. And again, it allows them to connect these two things that for them have been very separate into. Oh, yeah, my family really is a big motivation of why I'm here and I don't talk to them about school at all or when I do, I just talked to them maybe about the challenges or the negative. And how can I use that as motivation? Thanks for that question, Julia and I know there's been a lot of questions coming through. We want to try to get to those, but we're going to move on for the sake of time and then try to come back to some of those as we end today. This is really where we are, right? We know that knowing your student, knowing their readiness, diving deep, and exploration is what allows us to move intentionally into skill-building and information sharing in a way that is really student focused, in a way that is really coach light. That when we introduce a tool in a way that really allows the student the autonomy and really the knowledge of what's going to work for them and we make it their choice to use the tool. Unlike that first decision tree where we saw where we gave them the strategy, it either with something they use or something they didn't and they move forward. We know now that really the action that the student is going to take next is firmly in their control. And at this point as coaches, right, no matter how many suggestions we have made, we have to step away from the ownership and the judgment on what they do next. Because at this point, it really is within the student's responsibility to take those insights that they've gained from our appointment and take it out and make it into what they want it to be. And then come back to us hopefully and do some sharing. And by making it firmly their decision that sets us up as coaches to be able to start the whole process again when they come back in or maybe when when they come back and see us in two years because they haven't. We've ended our coaching relationship and they've moved within their degree and ultimately allows us to come back and really keep that coaching cycle going in a way that really holds true to coaching practices. But also understand the ethical and the institutional knowledge that we want to share as a result of that knowledge that we have, that maybe they don't. This is just a quick backend thing that you are doing as you're going through these coaching meetings. Often we talk about coaching questions as questions that we're asking students. But what I want you to think about is what are the questions that you're asking yourself? Am I really listening to the student? What am I observing? What else might be happening here? Is this the right time or even way to introduce a tool or this tool? And then did they first tried to come up with this themselves? They work a little bit. Did they think that? Did I stretch them a little bit here first and then at that point, I can feel really confident in saying, Okay, here's kinda some three strategies that might be helpful for you since we're kind of getting stuck here. What are your thoughts? Again, I love the way you mentioned this of giving them at least two or three different options to get the ball going a little bit more so that they have some ideas to go off of. So at this time, we would be happy to answer any questions. I want to actually get to a couple that are already in the chat and then I also am sharing the evaluation that you can get to. And of course, as soon as I put that in. Okay. Alicia and I are absolutely open to follow up. After this. I've put both of our email addresses on the screen. Please feel free to email us. We want to go to the chat now so I'm gonna stop sharing my screen so that we can see your faces. But please feel free to e-mail us if you have thoughts or questions, happy to share more. There was a question around how do you manage the time needed for the relationship building when you're very aware of time constraints, when a student walks in example mid semester trying to find progress in current course. And this is a really hard part. I think for me I always prioritize their relationship even if it's five-minutes, I'm very intentional about that piece. And then I'll say, I want to be really intentional about how I share that so that they can kinda know what to expect where they come in and they're like, Oh my gosh, this, this, this like, okay, let's take a breath. Tell me a little bit more about who you are. Even just in a minute. It doesn't take how to take that long. But it kinda just like D arms them a little bit and disarms them, I think. And then we're gonna come back to that for sure. But, you know, so just to kinda give them that because what I want them to do is feel comfortable enough with me that it's in when they're ready to come back, whether it's tomorrow, whether it's in two weeks or whether it's in two years, that they feel like they can do that and that they can ask for help them in the future. There's another question that came in about keeping time during an appointment, right? Because the student really owns the appointment, but we are the navigators helping them get through the appointment and helping to keep that time. And so we've had a lot of great suggestions actually come through. This idea of letting the student know when they have 15 minutes, ten minutes and five-minutes left, asking them what's most important to accomplish. In the remaining time. I have found I will share for any new coaches in the room. I have found that this is something that I've actually, I've gotten better at as I've practiced it. Again, having the framework really helps because I know I want to get through this in about two-thirds of my time so that with a third of the time remaining, I can move into some strategizing and next steps. But that's certainly and having semantics as having a clock, I have a clock that I can look at and O'clock that the student can look at behind me. I have two clocks in my office as well so that we both are aware of the time because I also don't want to get so wrapped up in something that the student misses their next glass. I'm awesome, Alyssa, share and I love this strategy. I let the student know when we have 15 minutes, ten minutes left, five-minutes left. It kinda serves as a guidepost for them and for you so that they can feel like, okay, I'm getting what I need out of this session. It's great. Awesome. And I know we're coming right up at time. I just want to mention how grateful I am again to be in this space with you all. How grateful I am to the team at Oklahoma who has set this up to all of our moderators today, Alicia was pulling double duty as well as our moderator and our presenter. This space is so powerful and I don't know about you all, but sometimes I feel a little bit of an island and my colleagues are on my campus. And the fact that we all have the space to come together and to share ideas, continue to use this community. This community is so powerful and I think is going to become even bigger and more of a resource. And so continued to use each other because we're all experts in this room and we appreciate everything that you've done in the chat to answer each other's questions. I think Alicia, can we stay on for just a couple of minutes in case people want to look through that. Yes. Okay. Great. We know that you have other sessions to go. We want to honor that. Alicia, any closing words? You Great. Thanks, everyone. Thanks for joining us today. Thank you so much. That was fantastic. We're so glad you enjoyed it. Thank you. You guys both rock. Thank you. Thank you. John Eaton from the University of California, Merced said, Yeah, I tried to go to that first conference when you were developing checks and I've been following and I went to another presentation that you and Atlanta had provided before. T is I'm following your work and your dissertation. I read that and it's good work. Just keep doing. What you're doing is fantastic. Thanks, John. Appreciate you so much. No worries. Have a good day. Yeah. Thank you. Thanks again. Job U2. I tried really hard to get myself to a different session, but I just couldn't still learn so much even though it's like the third time I've seen this, I don't know how many. Yeah, let's answer this really quick. Atlanta and then I have to hop off. You want to take this one? Yeah, So this is a great question. How do you support a student who comes in often in crisis with the same issues that we have worked on with no progress. I think for me it comes back to the trust that the student I have developed. If it's the third meeting and I feel like the student has developed a place of trust with me. I really feel like the student is in on coaching. I think at that point I can ask a little bit more of a prickly question in saying like we have been working on this three times. What is the barrier at this point? What has changed? And what are you noticing as you try to work on it. That said, I often also find that in those situations, it may be a case of a student having not shared enough throughout the appointments about what they need and that more potentially more support is needed. Sometimes there's a barrier that maybe our counseling and psychiatric office can help with that. I'm just not I am completely going to be willing to stay with the student through that, but sometimes tutoring as needed, sometimes it's not the amount they're studying, it's the way that they're approaching the coursework. And so I really like to just dig deeper a little bit on you seem to really be wanting to work in this, and I appreciate the effort. What is, what is the barrier and what can we do to move forward at this point, knowing that you've been working on it and what are you noticing? Because sometimes they'll they'll say, Well, I'm noticing it wasn't it's not necessarily the biggest thing coming up. Or sometimes they'll tell me some other things. Alicia, your thoughts? I'll just do this quickly. I mean, I think it's yeah, one for sure reflecting back on what you're observing. I'm noticing this, but this is happening, etc. I think to drawing set boundaries. I really want to support you, but to be honest, like, it's really been challenging for me to figure out where do we go because there's so many ways that we can take it and you're having a really hard time narrowing in on 11 area to work on. A lot of times this has mental health-related. So really trying to have that conversation artfully is really important. I had a really skilled colleague, Audrey Blake and Hine, who really knew how to do this well, and she has counseling backgrounds, so she was able to navigate it, but but she was able to say like you can you need to earn that, you need to. But she did this much better. But counseling alongside coaching can be really beneficial. And oftentimes, when we see that happening, students are able to make such so much more progress because they're getting that counseling, they're getting, getting at some of those deeper rooted things and also able to move forward and take action. I think coupling those together when possible, where you're working alongside the counseling as well. And recognize any institutional barriers to, there could be institutional barriers of the students up against that they don't realize are institutional barriers that we, again have the context and the knowledge to know. Again, is the student just, are they not in a situation to know about some of the things that they can take advantage of and can we help to guide them as well? Okay. I know we have to go because they should have another session starting. Thank you. You all. Thanks, Alicia.